Fire in WTC7 before second WTC attack

**stannrodd** · 22 Dec 2006 , 01:31 AM

Hi all,

I was looking through some pics of WTC7 taken after the WTC1 hit and then Just before the second hit.

I was looking at detail of the window washer crane movements and what appears to be a fire.

What concerns me about these two photos is that...

1 WTC1 has been hit and is burning

2 No big collapse yet or debris going APE all over. perhaps some small localized ground fires associated with burning debris from the initial impact.

3 There appears to be a fire in WTC7 already

You figure ??!!

Stann

JackX · 7 Jan 2007 , 16:17 PM

Stann:

Doubt the fire idea: no smoke.
Sun reflections ?

Cheers!

**stannrodd** · 8 Jan 2007 , 22:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JackX

Stann:

Doubt the fire idea: no smoke.
Sun reflections ?

Cheers!

Good point. How silly of me.

Perhaps it was lighting from a press conference

Stann

Phil Jayhan · 9 Jan 2007 , 00:32 AM

To be honest, this looks like another separate explosion in the works to me. No doubt it started fires afterward. but the fact there is no smoke, any which can be discerned anyways, means little, especially if this is an explosion. I have seen many little charges going off in the North Tower at the same time the South Tower got hit. Simple smoke and mirrors dog and pony show. Distraction, then other things happens while everyones attention is on the South Tower.
To me, it appears to be a charge going off in WTC 7 at the same time WTC 1, or the South Tower gets hit by the plane. A real plane.

Anyone else see this as well? And can we get any better pictures from another angle at this same time?

cheers-
phil

**stannrodd** · 9 Jan 2007 , 01:36 AM

Taking Jackx's comment into account with respect to sunlight reflection perhaps.

But looking at the scenario. A major event had just happened like WTC1 had been damaged very badly and was burning. It would be the perfect opportunity to start the destruction of WTC7.

The fact that no smoke is apparent is not necessarily a killer of the fire theory. The building had not been damaged from the WTC1 attack as far as we know. The smoke from a fire could have been contained within the building. Sorry Jack I still think this is a possibility.

I would like all members to have a look at their photo archives and see if there is another angle pic of WTC7 as Phil has suggested. Preferably it would be between the two attacks on the twin towers.

WTC1 burning and WTC2 still not attacked. It's a critical time zone for deception to occur.

How long was it between the two attacks?

Thanks
Stann

**bvdd** · 10 Jan 2007 , 16:09 PM

17 minutes.

North tower struck at 8:46 .. South tower struck at 9:03.

**EugeneAxeman** · 19 Jan 2007 , 19:32 PM

The sunlight reflection does not not seem terribly plausible, since the pictures were taken from the north. The abberation on the left side could be the result of a double reflection, but I'd have to do the geometry to be sure.

The time separation would be nice to know, because the more time that passes, the farther along the building the reflection should move. What bothers me is that the distortion, or whatever it is, seems to become brighter and remains in the same place in the second photo.

If it were a reflection of sunlight, it should move from right to left, and be less bright in the second picture, because it would be moving off of the building.

It could be completely unrelated, or it might mean something.

Regardless, it should be thoroughly checked out but it probably won't.

**ricochet** · 19 Jan 2007 , 21:17 PM

Quote:

3 There appears to be a fire in WTC7 - already

You figure ??!!

Stann

I've found you some evidence that WTC 7 was on fire as early as the second hit. This means before the first collapse. The following quote is from Richard Sheirer, Guliani's # 2 man on the scene lamenting the fire at the 23 rd floor OEM.

http://nymag.com/nymetro/news/sept11/features/5270/

Quote:

On the morning of September 11, Sheirer got to City Hall at 8 a.m. for a meeting about the Jackie Robinson-Pee Wee Reese memorial planned for Coney Island. "I was in heaven, sitting between Ralph Branca and Joe Black," he remembers. "We were about to select the statue, and then we heard the pop." At first he thought a transformer had exploded in an underground substation. Then he got a flash report from Watch Command in OEM headquarters.

As his driver barreled down Broadway, Sheirer recalls, "my first move was to clear the streets so we could get emergency vehicles in and people out." He radioed the police department and told them to shut down traffic below Canal Street and close every bridge and tunnel in the city.

Down at the scene, he joined Fire Commissioner Tom Von Essen and his chiefs Pete Ganci and Bill Feehan -- old friends from Sheirer's 26 years with the New York Fire Department. They were establishing a command post at the base of the burning tower. Then the second airplane hit. "At that point there was no more doubt," he says ruefully. "We were under attack." He picked up one of the three cell phones strapped to his belt and started giving orders: to the Coast Guard to seal the harbor, and to the State Emergency Management Office to send backup search and rescue teams and get the Pentagon to freeze the city's airspace. Then he lost his signal.

As Sheirer helped move the Fire Department command post, he saw a cloud of smoke and debris engulf his own command center, on the twenty-third floor of 7 World Trade Center. His staff was inside sending alerts to representatives of nearly 100 organizations -- everyone from Con Edison to the Department of Health. One of his deputies radioed him to report that the OEM would have to evacuate.

**stannrodd** · 20 Jan 2007 , 01:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ricochet quoted

..."As Sheirer helped move the Fire Department command post, he saw a cloud of smoke and debris engulf his own command center, on the twenty-third floor of 7 World Trade Center. His staff was inside sending alerts to representatives of nearly 100 organizations -- everyone from Con Edison to the Department of Health. One of his deputies radioed him to report that the OEM would have to evacuate."

Who's going to count down from 47 to 23, I haven't done it yet. Doing a summer BBQ here in NZ and dropped in for an update. Also got a comet to look at tonight if the clouds clear.

This may be a hit piece for LetsRoll.

We need a clear view of WTC7 from the same angle but showing a bit more detail, to show floor levels etc.

Here's one I had for another reason about the WW building (left) and it's strategic position. The brown building to the right is WTC7

http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/8...evenwtc9kg.jpg

Anyone want to do a bit of geometry and see if the "fire" is at about level 23 as perhaps reported.

All efforts at this accepted.

Stann

PS Thanks for the 17 minutes bvdd !! ..

**ricochet** · 20 Jan 2007 , 12:17 PM

It seems to be about floors 27 to 29. The fact remains however that Sheirer saw the OEM engulfed by smoke and debris before any collapse. The question now is what caused this to the OEM prior to being hit by the falling towers?
Stann have fun at your BBQ. Post some pics of the comet!

22 Dec 2006 , 01:31 AM	#1
stannrodd Free Mind Join Date: 6 Sep 2004 Location: Aotearoa (New Zealand) Posts: 4,928 Threads: 250 Thanked 19 Times in 8 Posts	Fire in WTC7 before second WTC attack Hi all, I was looking through some pics of WTC7 taken after the WTC1 hit and then Just before the second hit. I was looking at detail of the window washer crane movements and what appears to be a fire. What concerns me about these two photos is that... 1 WTC1 has been hit and is burning 2 No big collapse yet or debris going APE all over. perhaps some small localized ground fires associated with burning debris from the initial impact. 3 There appears to be a fire in WTC7 already You figure ??!! Stann __________________ It riles them to believe That you perceive The web they weave .. And keep on thinking free... Graeme Edge

7 Jan 2007 , 16:17 PM	#2
JackX Privileged Join Date: 30 Oct 2004 Posts: 344 Threads: 69 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Stann: Doubt the fire idea: no smoke. Sun reflections ? Cheers! __________________ My grammar sux, I know, so ... ... read between the lines instead.

9 Jan 2007 , 00:32 AM	#4
Phil Jayhan Admin Join Date: 23 Feb 2004 Location: Middle Earth Posts: 20,390 Threads: 2498 Blog Entries: 25 Thanked 739 Times in 413 Posts	Re: Fire in WTC7 before second WTC attack To be honest, this looks like another separate explosion in the works to me. No doubt it started fires afterward. but the fact there is no smoke, any which can be discerned anyways, means little, especially if this is an explosion. I have seen many little charges going off in the North Tower at the same time the South Tower got hit. Simple smoke and mirrors dog and pony show. Distraction, then other things happens while everyones attention is on the South Tower. To me, it appears to be a charge going off in WTC 7 at the same time WTC 1, or the South Tower gets hit by the plane. A real plane. Anyone else see this as well? And can we get any better pictures from another angle at this same time? cheers- phil __________________ Phil Jayhan 9/11 Blog \| Phil Jayhan v666 Blog \| Frederick Bastiats Audio of "The Law" "In disquisitions of every kind there are certain primary truths, or first principles, upon which all subsequent reasoning must depend." --Alexander Hamilton

9 Jan 2007 , 01:36 AM	#5
stannrodd Free Mind Join Date: 6 Sep 2004 Location: Aotearoa (New Zealand) Posts: 4,928 Threads: 250 Thanked 19 Times in 8 Posts	Taking Jackx's comment into account with respect to sunlight reflection perhaps. But looking at the scenario. A major event had just happened like WTC1 had been damaged very badly and was burning. It would be the perfect opportunity to start the destruction of WTC7. The fact that no smoke is apparent is not necessarily a killer of the fire theory. The building had not been damaged from the WTC1 attack as far as we know. The smoke from a fire could have been contained within the building. Sorry Jack I still think this is a possibility. I would like all members to have a look at their photo archives and see if there is another angle pic of WTC7 as Phil has suggested. Preferably it would be between the two attacks on the twin towers. WTC1 burning and WTC2 still not attacked. It's a critical time zone for deception to occur. How long was it between the two attacks? Thanks Stann __________________ It riles them to believe That you perceive The web they weave .. And keep on thinking free... Graeme Edge

19 Jan 2007 , 19:32 PM	#7
EugeneAxeman Reader Join Date: 19 Oct 2006 Location: Northern California Posts: 19 Threads: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	The sunlight reflection does not not seem terribly plausible, since the pictures were taken from the north. The abberation on the left side could be the result of a double reflection, but I'd have to do the geometry to be sure. The time separation would be nice to know, because the more time that passes, the farther along the building the reflection should move. What bothers me is that the distortion, or whatever it is, seems to become brighter and remains in the same place in the second photo. If it were a reflection of sunlight, it should move from right to left, and be less bright in the second picture, because it would be moving off of the building. It could be completely unrelated, or it might mean something. Regardless, it should be thoroughly checked out but it probably won't. __________________ When the Cowboys and Arabs Draw down on each other at noon In the cool dusky air Of the city board room Will you stand by a passive spectator Of the market dictators

10 Jan 2007 , 16:09 PM	#6
bvdd Writer Join Date: 3 Apr 2006 Location: Rochester, NH Posts: 322 Threads: 34 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	17 minutes. North tower struck at 8:46 .. South tower struck at 9:03.

20 Jan 2007 , 12:17 PM	#10
ricochet Moderator Join Date: 25 Nov 2004 Location: Parked diagonally in a parallel universe Posts: 1,217 Threads: 92 Thanked 72 Times in 38 Posts	It seems to be about floors 27 to 29. The fact remains however that Sheirer saw the OEM engulfed by smoke and debris before any collapse. The question now is what caused this to the OEM prior to being hit by the falling towers? Stann have fun at your BBQ. Post some pics of the comet! __________________ In a dictatorship no one can hear you scream...