Fl# 11 Passenger - Judith Camilla Larocque Frankel - Member of CFR

**do2read** · 4 Jul 2010 , 00:01 AM

Flight #11 Passenger, Carefully Prepared Alias, a Actor, or...? Judith Camilla Larocque Frankel - Member of Council of Foreign Relations

Judith C. Larocque was the 50 yr old CEO of Market Perspectives, a market research firm about which nothing comes up on any searches.

Links: http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/mem...ople/1379.html
http://www.legacy.com/Sept11/Story.aspx?PersonID=91840

Quote:

Judith Camilla "Judy" Larocque (Frankel)

Quote:

American Flight 11

Her Business, Her Retriever

Judy Larocque founded and led a small company in Framingham, Mass., called Market Perspectives, and she had a golden retriever named Naboo. They were pillars in her life, said her daughters, Carie and Danielle Lemack. More than that: the dog and the company were her children, too.

That realization brought responsibilities. Carie Lemack went to the company's offices to tell employees that Ms. Larocque's plane, American Airlines Flight 11 out of Boston, had crashed. Danielle Lemack, a lawyer in Chicago, met with board members. Naboo needed to be walked, and loved, and perhaps consoled, too. "The company was her creation," Carie Lemack said. "I would say it was her third baby, but that would be Naboo, so it was her fourth."

Ms. Larocque, 50, had been seeking a new balance of work and life recently, and did so with the intensity she brought to everything. She walked 60 miles for a breast cancer fund-raiser in May, and had rediscovered a passion of her youth: yoga.
Profile published in THE NEW YORK TIMES on October 13, 2001.

Judith Larocque,
led research firm

By Globe Staff, 9/22/2001 Judith Frankel Larocque of Framingham, founder and CEO of a market research company, was killed Sept. 11 in the crash of American Airlines Flight 11 in New York City. She was 50.

Ms. Larocque graduated from Boston University with a degree in psychology.

After working for technology companies including Digital Equipment Corp., MassComp, and BBN, she founded and became CEO of Market Perspectives Inc., a real-time market research company for high-tech companies.

She lived most of her life near Lake Cochituate, and recently rediscovered the lake with her golden retriever, Naboo.

She leaves two daughters, Danielle and Carie Lemack.

Services will be private.

Editorial Obituary published in THE BOSTON GLOBE on September 22, 2001.

Two daughters are listed in each article. Lets start with Danielle Bette Lemack, her eldest. Danielle was a Chicago Copyright and Intellectual Property Attorney.

Link: http://www.law.northwestern.edu/news...&source=eb0206

Quote:

January 04, 2006
Pattishall, McAuliffe

PATTISHALL, MCAULIFFE ELECTS A NEW PARTNER

The Firm of Pattishall, McAuliffe, Newbury, Hilliard & Geraldson LLP is pleased to announce that Danielle B. Lemack has been elected to the Partnership. Danielle's election is particularly meaningful to the Firm, as the Firm has had the privilege to work with Danielle since she also joined the Firm as a summer associate during law school at the University of Michigan.

Danielle B. Lemack concentrates her practice in the trade identity field, including trademark, copyright, unfair competition, advertising, and trade secret law. She is experienced in the areas of trademark, trade dress, unfair competition and domain name litigation including federal litigation, opposition and cancellation proceedings before the Trademark Trial and Appeal Board and domain name infringement actions under the Uniform Dispute Resolution Policy and has worked with clients in a broad range of fields, including automotive, technology, travel, Internet, bio-chemical, pharmaceutical, beverage and toy companies.

Danielle's commitment to the law also includes academic and professional education. Danielle has been an Adjunct Professor of Law at Northwestern University School of Law, teaching Trademarks and Unfair Competition. She spoke on a panel about the practice of intellectual property law at Northwestern University School of Law's Intellectual Property Week 2004. At the 2004 Summer IPL Conference, Danielle gave a presentation on pop-up ads and keyword advertising.

Danielle is a member of the Intellectual Property Law and Litigation sections of the American Bar Association, the American Intellectual Property Law Association, the Intellectual Property Law Association of Chicago, the Illinois Bar Association and the Chicago Bar Association. Danielle has served as the chair of the subcommittee on False Advertising of the American Intellectual Property Law Association. In addition, Danielle served as a Director and officer of Families of September 11th Inc.

Rich in experience and history, Pattishall, McAuliffe, Newbury, Hilliard & Geraldson LLP constitutes one of the largest trademark practices in the United States. Practice concentrations include domestic and international trademark, copyright, Internet, e-commerce, advertising, trade secret, and unfair trade practices law and litigation.

Danielle Lemack also was (like Tania Head) Vice President of the families group Families of Sept. 11 (FOS11). Here she is in that capacity, speaking about tolerance for Muslims.

Link: http://www.cairchicago.org/inthenews...le=tdn09292004

Quote:

Danielle Lemack, vice president for Families of September 11, said such a dialogue is necessary to confront the deterioration of U.S.-Muslim relations.

"We need to understand them and we need to try and help them understand us," said Lemack, whose mother was aboard American Airlines Flight 11.

Here she is doing a seminar at a Law Conference.

Link: http://www.abanet.org/intelprop/summ...m_schedule.pdf

Quote:

Charting the Waters of Fair Use on the Internet: A Practical
Discussion on Third Party Trademark Use on the Internet

Danielle Lemack, Pattishall, McAuliffe, Newbury, Hilliard

& Geraldson LLP, Chicago, IL

Danielle is quoted several times in this very interesting document. It is and "Occaisional Paper" by the Rand Corporation, a research firm that has ties to the CIA. Too long to quote, but a really interesting read. Kinda like a 911 performance report.

Link: http://www.rand.org/pubs/occasional_...ND_OP180-1.pdf

Problem is, if you search for her, here is what you get.

All of the right addresses for someone from Framingham, Schooled at Ann Arbor, and in Chicago, but age 61?

Here she is the right age, but has Caroe Lemack listed at the same address, with a different birth date (not an alias).

In this one, she's the right age, but there's a daniella aged 61. Also a Christian, aged 40, not anywhere else, and a Berton Robinson, also nowhere else.

Sometime in the last couple of years, she moved to Belmont, Mass., and here she is writing an opinion piece about building a school.

link: http://www.wickedlocal.com/belmont/n...new-Wellington

So how old is Danielle Lemack, and who are her family members?

If you look up Judith, you get some more.

If you go with this one with the right age you get,

The ages are right, but Caroe is listed.

All of this brings us to Carie Lemack. She is a member of the Council on Foreign Relations. You can check here: http://www.cfr.org/about/membership/....html?letter=L

No Kidding.

If you search for Carie Lemack you'll see the same kind of thing.

Carie and Caroe side by side.

And Danielle is 61 again!

Carie Lemack has been a prolific advocate for the victim's families, speaking and testifying, even before Congress. She has done numerous talk shows and interviews over the years.

These photos are just a few of the many faces of Carie Lemack to be found on the web.

Mother/Daughter

Other researchers have concluded that they have used actresses to portray Ms. LeMack. It might be worth looking into.

Carrie was the co-founder of the Families of Sept. 11 group. How convenient to have someone on the CFR, with direct ties to the Rockefeller organization, to found and head the Families group.

Anyway, If anyone has time to dig deeper, there is more than meets the eye in this convoluted tale.

9/11 LINKS INDEX - Victim Fraud, Media Fraud

Radio Shows - Jim Fetzer & The Real Deal:

9/11 World Trade Center Props

Exif/IPTC Metadata:

EXIF Data Similarities - VERY REVEALING INFORMATION

Video: Fraudulence on 9/11

Death Certificate #0001:

Social Security Death Payments & Other SSDI Related Evidence

Social Security Death Payments for 9/11 Victims

The Hollow Towers & Pre-Demolition of WTC:

The World Trade Center Lighting & Picture History

The Elevators at WTC on 9/11 and the Trapped People:

Outrageous WTC 9/11 elevator stories exposed

Revisiting the World Trade Center Phone Calls:

Revisiting the WTC 911 calls

Fireman Actors on 9/11:

Stand In Actors on 9/11:

Flight 11 Frauds:

Flight 175 Frauds:

Flight 77 Frauds:

Flight 93 Frauds:

The 911 Jumper Frauds:

North Tower Frauds:

Pentagon Fraudulent Victims on 9/11:

Media Complicity and Fraud:

Media 9/11 Memorial Frauds:

The 9/11 Memorial Wall:

The 9/11 Victims Memorial Wall in New York City - Was it a Ruse?

9/11 & WTC Corporate Fraud:

Pending Research Requests from Lets Roll Members:

MISC: Great Research Links on this Material above:

Former Stickies for the Hussled Masses:

Pictures of Extra Equipment on Look-A-Like Flight 175 (109,720 Views)
911 For Dummies Thread. Video, Picture Archive of 911 (7,513,922 Views)
Targeting Laser Light Spot at the World Trade Center! (121,515 Views)
"Flight 175" WAS a Cargo/FUEL TANKER (159,126 Views)
New Photo of 767 Showing 2nd Piece of Equip / Port Engine (233,137 Views)
9/11 LINKS INDEX - Victim Fraud, Media Fraud, WTC Fraud

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**do2read** · 4 Jul 2010 , 00:25 AM

Judith Laroque nor Judith Frankel are in the Death Index.

She IS listed on the Victim's Compensation Fund report, and the Beneficiary is Wayne Larocque.

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**do2read** · 4 Jul 2010 , 00:42 AM

Here is Carie's Bio from her CFR page.

Link: http://www.cfr.org/bios/15504/carie_a_lemack.html

Quote:

Carie A. Lemack

Quote:

International Affairs Fellow, 2009-2010

Carie A. Lemack is the co-founder of the non-profit, non-partisan organization Families of September 11. She helped to create and then lead the organization after her mother was killed on American Airlines Flight 11 that crashed into the World Trade Center.

Families of September 11 has grown to more than 2,800 members under her leadership. Carie successfully advocated alongside other family members for the creation of the 9/11 investigative commission as well as for passage of the Intelligence Reform and Terrorism Prevention Act of 2004. According to its chair, Governor Thomas Kean, the 9/11 Commission never would have happened without the influence of Carie and her fellow advocates.

Currently running her own national security business, The Camilla Group, LLC, Carie remains focused on working with government, private sector and nonprofit organizations to improve the nation’s safety and security. She initiates and implements forward-thinking projects on critical homeland security issues, such as the prevention of nuclear terrorism and improved aviation security.

Carie received her BS from Stanford University, MA from Harvard University, and MBA from Stanford University. She is a term member of the Council on Foreign Relations and is a lifelong member of Red Sox Nation.

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**do2read** · 4 Jul 2010 , 00:53 AM

Searching for information on The Camilla Group, LLC, will bring only one result.

http://www.camillagroup.com/

Quote:

Welcome to the Camilla Group, LLC.

Quote:

Currently this site is undergoing maintenance.
If you need to contact Carie Lemack, please
email: carie_lemack@camillagroup.com
Thank you!

Not even a feeble attempt at a front.

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**do2read** · 4 Jul 2010 , 01:04 AM

This CFR page talks about the Term Member Program for young leaders. Carie is part of this program.

Quote:

Term Member Program

The Stephen M. Kellen Term
Member Program encourages promising
young leaders from diverse
backgrounds to engage in a sustained
conversation on international affairs
and U.S. foreign policy. Each year a
new class of term members between
the ages of thirty and thirty-six is
elected to a five-year membership.
The program provides them the
opportunity to interact with foreign
policy experts and participate in a
wide variety of events.
In the fall, term members convened
in both New York and Washington,
DC, to welcome the new class
and brainstorm about the issues they
hoped to address during the program
year. New members were paired with
more seasoned ones to familiarize
the incoming class with the program.
This spring, third- and fourth-year
term members were also paired with
life members to foster their integration
into the Council and provide
meaningful interaction between term
members and life members.
In its twelfth year, the annual Term
Member Conference remains the
premier event of the program. This

year’s conference,

Campaign 2008:

The Foreign Policy Challenges Ahead

,

focused largely on global issues the

next U.S. administration will need to
address. Highlights included a session
with Council Co-Chairman

Robert

E. Rubin

and former chairman of

the Federal Reserve

Paul A. Volcker,

who candidly discussed the resilience

of the global economy and challenges
facing the next president. The conference
also had panels addressing the
war in Iraq and climate change policy.
A panel with the permanent representatives
of China, Germany, and
Egypt to the United Nations offered
views from abroad. Breakout sessions
gave participants an opportunity
to meet in small groups to discuss a
range of topics, including intelligence
reform, the future of Russia, China
before the 2008 Olympics, and new
challenges in Africa. A town hall
meeting hosted by Council President

Richard N. Haass

concluded the

conference with a discussion ranging

from U.S. foreign policy challenges to
the future of the Council.
Overall, this year the Term
Member Program featured more
than thirty-five roundtable sessions,
movie screenings, and book club
events in New York and Washington,
DC. The program touched on
a broad spectrum of issues, including
multilateralism and the United
Nations, military strategy in Iraq and
Afghanistan, and digital openness
and the balance between privacy and
national security. Term members also
had the chance to speak over dinner
with Council fellows, including

Walter Russell Mead

, Noah Feldman,

Michael J. Gerson

, Michael A.

Levi

, Max Boot, Steven Simon, and

Stephen Biddle

.

The Lessons Learned series continues

to be an important highlight
of the program’s offerings. This
roundtable series, where distinguished
individuals reflect upon
their career experiences, featured
Council President Emeritus

Leslie

H. Gelb

, Council Honorary Vice

Chairman

Maurice R. Greenberg,

Foreign Affairs

editor James F. Hoge

Jr.

, former U.S. Senate majority

leader

George J. Mitchell (D-ME),

vice chairman of the Joint Chiefs of

Staff General

James E. Cartwright,

Council Board member and former

administrator of the Environmental
Protection Agency

Christine Todd

Whitman

, and Carnegie Corporation

president

Vartan Gregorian.

Term Member Program 49

Term Member Trips

Term members enjoyed five trips during

which they met with the leaders and
high-level officials of several institutions
to deepen their understanding of current
foreign policy challenges. In the fall, they
visited the Federal Reserve Bank of New
York for a day-long program focused on
the role of the New York Fed in conducting
monetary policy and on the evolving
global economy. Federal Reserve Bank
of New York president and CEO

Timothy

F. Geithner

spoke on global challenges and

policy responses from the view of a central

banker. Term members gathered in January
at the World Bank in Washington, DC, to
discuss development in the world’s poorest
countries, business in the Arab world, and
climate change. World Bank president

Robert B. Zoellick

led a conversation

on the challenges of creating an effective

multilateral system. In February, term
members were welcomed to the U.S. naval
base in Norfolk, Virginia, by Admiral

Jonathan W. Greenert

, commander of

the U.S. Fleet Forces Command, for two

days of sessions on naval capabilities and
strategic insights on foreign and defense
policy. In the spring, term members
met with senior officials at the Central
Intelligence Agency for briefings on
China, Iran, and counterterrorism, and
visited Capitol Hill for discussions with
members of Congress on shaping the
foreign policy agenda.

Opposite:

Helima L. Croft, Council International

Affairs Fellow Michelle D. Gavin, and Adam

Wolfensohn at the Twelfth Annual Term Member
Conference.

Right:

Andrew C. Huszar, Carie A. Lemack,

and Dylan C. Pereira on a term member trip

to Norfolk, Virginia.

Unfortunately you have to take the link to look at the photograph of Carie, as it wouldn't allow me to copy it.

Ms. Lemack is on the fast track to becoming a "leader".

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**do2read** · 9 Jul 2010 , 00:15 AM

In 2007, Carie was the guest of Nancy Pelosi, at the State of the Union Address.

Quote:

Pelosi also invited two of the more influential 9/11 widows, Carrie Lemack and Mary Fetchet,

link: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...012201620.html

Even though she is not part of this article, she's still there as the Poster Child/Face of the 911 Family.

link: http://teacher.scholastic.com/schola...le=911families

Here Carie gives a speech urging support for the 911 Commission's Report before it even came out.

link: http://www.boston.com/news/globe/edi..._911_we_stand/

Just like her CFR handlers would like.

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Phil Jayhan · 9 Jul 2010 , 15:15 PM

Judith Frankel is in the Social Security Death Index, just not for 9/11/2001:

http://ssdi.rootsweb.ancestry.com

NameBirthDeathLast ResidenceLast BenefitSSNIssuedToolsOrder

Record? JUDITH B FRANKEL 12 Aug 194220 Mar 2008 (P)94123 (San Francisco, San Francisco, CA)(none specified)027-32-3999MassachusettsSS-5 Letter

Add Post-em

Search Ancestry.com

JUDITH B FRANKEL 16 Jul 192206 May 2009 (V)04473 (Orono, Penobscot, ME)(none specified)047-14-8225ConnecticutSS-5 Letter

Add Post-em

Search Ancestry.com

JUDITH FRANKEL 11 Aug 192222 Dec 2007 (V) 953 (PE)(none specified)072-12-7743New YorkSS-5 Letter

Add Post-em

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JUDITH FRANKEL 13 Mar 1912 - 09 Mar 2001 (V)02467 (Chestnut Hill, Middlesex, MA) (none specified) 087-26-7595New York SS-5 Letter

Add Post-em

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JUDITH FRANKEL 11 Aug 192616 Sep 1998 (V)94127 (San Francisco, San Francisco, CA)94127 (San Francisco, San Francisco, CA)130-14-0988New YorkSS-5 Letter

Add Post-em

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JUDITH C FRANKEL 12 Nov 1944 - 12 Aug 2002 (P)92105 (San Diego, San Diego, CA) (none specified) 557-62-1297 CaliforniaSS-5 Letter

Add Post-em

Search Ancestry.com

There is no Judith Larocque in the Social Security Death Index:

http://ssdi.rootsweb.ancestry.com

Field Value Records Results Last Name

LAROCQUE 996996

First Name

JUDITH 48129 0 Records Found

**do2read** · 9 Jul 2010 , 15:40 PM

There are no Birthdays above even close to 1951, her supposed birth year.

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**do2read** · 9 Jul 2010 , 16:15 PM

Judith LaRocque was the Founder and CEO of Market Perspectives, a Market Research firm based in Framingham, Mass.

The firm specialized in Trade Show market research, and Virtual Trade Shows on the Internet.

The company would design software and interfaces to perform customer surveys at Trade Show Kiosks, or online at Virtual Trade Shows.

The Trade show business was dwindling, so the company was moving heavier into the online end of things, or so the story goes.

So, if Market Perspectives was a Tech Savvy Internet Company, then why is there almost nothing at all on the web testifying to their existence? I could only find 3 instances on the web related to Market Perspectives. Two of the three are published in the months prior to 9/11 (Feb., and May 2001).

The first is an Industry related book published in Feb. 2001 where one of the co-authors is an exec at Market Perspectives. http://www.quirks.com/articles/a2001...5050471&sort=9

The second involves Market Perspective's Business Model being used as an example in an MIT Business Forum. http://www.mitforumcambridge.org/cases/c_may01.html

Both of these could easily be fake backstory plants, very thin.

The third reference was on a guy's online resume'. He says he wrote code for MPI in 1995, as a Web Developer.

OK, so if they were a Tech dependent company, employed a full time Software Engineer for Web Development, then why are these their only appearances on the web?

Unless someone can find more than I, there is something very fishy about a company almost 9 years in a Tech related business being a ghost on the web.

Found one more short reference from 1996. http://www.wpiventureforum.org/Image...VF/mar1996.pdf

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**do2read** · 9 Jul 2010 , 17:34 PM

Here is Carie in her favorite role, pimping the 911 Commission's recommendations, something no real family member could possibly buy.

link: http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion...dog-role_x.htm

Quote:

Posted 12/27/2005 8:53 PM Updated 12/27/2005 8:57 PM

As 9/11 watchdog role ends, who will pick up baton? By Carie Lemack
On Friday, with little fanfare, one of the success stories of the war on terror will quietly disappear.

Chairman of the 9/11 Commission Thomas Kean, right, and Co Chair, Lee Hamilton.

By Mark Wilson, Getty ImagesSince the naming of former New Jersey governor Thomas Kean and former Indiana congressman Lee Hamilton to head the 9/11 Commission in 2002, the panel and its successor, the non-profit 9/11 Public Discourse Project, have proved that constructive self-criticism can be the greatest advantage of free societies against those who plot their destruction.
Before my mother, Judy Larocque, was murdered on American Airlines Flight 11 on Sept. 11, 2001, I trusted that my government would protect me and my family. I now know differently. This realization in 2001 led me to co-found the Families of September 11, which, among others, promoted establishment of the commission. During this past summer, I decided to get an "insider's" perspective on the commission's efforts as a fellow.
This month, the five Republican and five Democrat former commission members issued their final report on our government's ability to respond to and prevent terrorist attacks. Many of the grades were failing, including 17 D's and F's. There was only one A-.
But based on the reaction that the report card and subsequent closing of the 9/11 project received from our elected officials, I had to wonder, was anyone listening?
Old recommendations
Most of the commissioners' recommendations were not new. But there was something special about the 9/11 commissioners that set their work apart. They chose cooperation over partisanship and presented a united front to the public and administration. In the process, they fought for, and won, an unprecedented level of access to secret documents — over the fierce resistance of the White House and executive branch agencies.
When the original report was released in 2004, all 10 commissioners agreed to maintain their unity and see their recommendations through. They created the 9/11 project to keep pressure on Congress and the White House to overhaul the intelligence community.
In the years and months before 9/11, many federal agencies failed to fulfill their most basic responsibilities, as the commission documented in its original report.
More than four years after the attacks, shocking gaps remain in our nation's defense against terrorism. Keeping a watchful, skeptical eye on the government is in the best tradition of our republic.
As the commissioners go their separate ways, the question remains: Who will champion the reforms that haven't been adopted?
Unfinished business
Congress has still not created a risk-based formula for the billions of dollars in homeland security grants it doles out each year. Major gaps in aviation security have not been closed: air cargo (carried under passengers' feet) is rarely inspected, and passengers are still not screened by the Transportation Security Administration against a consolidated terror watch list.
Progress to address the greatest threat — the threat of nuclear terrorism — does not appear to be a top priority. At the current rate, the U.S. government's effort to "lock down" nuclear materials in the former Soviet Union, so it can't be stolen or bought by terrorists, will not be completed for 14 years.
And the most difficult recommendation from the 9/11 Commission has been all but abandoned: Who will push Congress to reorganize itself to provide adequate oversight over intelligence and homeland security?
With the release of their critical but fair report card, the commissioners made their last stand, a call to adapt before the terrorists exploit our vulnerabilities again.
This week, with their silent but graceful exit from the public square, they will put the hard work of self-reflection and reform back into our hands. Will we, and our government, answer the call?
Carie Lemack is co-founder of Families of September 11, a non-profit organization that includes family members, survivors and the public.

Here are some more pics of the ever changing Ms. Lemack.

Almost always clutching her security blanket prop- picture of her mother, playing the sympathy card to do the work of the Elite.

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4 Jul 2010 , 00:25 AM	#2
do2read Moderator Join Date: 26 Jan 2005 Posts: 1,912 Threads: 92 Thanked 4,769 Times in 1,315 Posts	Judith Laroque nor Judith Frankel are in the Death Index. She IS listed on the Victim's Compensation Fund report, and the Beneficiary is Wayne Larocque. l __________________ "Don't worry about it - Americans don't read." Allan Dulles ...

9 Jul 2010 , 15:40 PM	#8
do2read Moderator Join Date: 26 Jan 2005 Posts: 1,912 Threads: 92 Thanked 4,769 Times in 1,315 Posts	There are no Birthdays above even close to 1951, her supposed birth year. l __________________ "Don't worry about it - Americans don't read." Allan Dulles ...

9 Jul 2010 , 16:15 PM	#9
do2read Moderator Join Date: 26 Jan 2005 Posts: 1,912 Threads: 92 Thanked 4,769 Times in 1,315 Posts	Judith LaRocque was the Founder and CEO of Market Perspectives, a Market Research firm based in Framingham, Mass. The firm specialized in Trade Show market research, and Virtual Trade Shows on the Internet. The company would design software and interfaces to perform customer surveys at Trade Show Kiosks, or online at Virtual Trade Shows. The Trade show business was dwindling, so the company was moving heavier into the online end of things, or so the story goes. So, if Market Perspectives was a Tech Savvy Internet Company, then why is there almost nothing at all on the web testifying to their existence? I could only find 3 instances on the web related to Market Perspectives. Two of the three are published in the months prior to 9/11 (Feb., and May 2001). The first is an Industry related book published in Feb. 2001 where one of the co-authors is an exec at Market Perspectives. http://www.quirks.com/articles/a2001...5050471&sort=9 The second involves Market Perspective's Business Model being used as an example in an MIT Business Forum. http://www.mitforumcambridge.org/cases/c_may01.html Both of these could easily be fake backstory plants, very thin. The third reference was on a guy's online resume'. He says he wrote code for MPI in 1995, as a Web Developer. OK, so if they were a Tech dependent company, employed a full time Software Engineer for Web Development, then why are these their only appearances on the web? Unless someone can find more than I, there is something very fishy about a company almost 9 years in a Tech related business being a ghost on the web. Found one more short reference from 1996. http://www.wpiventureforum.org/Image...VF/mar1996.pdf l __________________ "Don't worry about it - Americans don't read." Allan Dulles ...