 15 Nov 2010
, 16:37 PM
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The Hollow Towers, Reality Shack Forum & Simon Shack
I have been a lurker here at these forums since the Mike Rivero discovery and want to thank you for all your research here. I have followed it every step of the way since then and finally wanted to sign up and say a few things about it. I am also a lurker at Reality Shack forums run by Simon Shack and have been for at least 2 years or more. Before then I ran in hopeless circles trying to understand the events of that day. And seeing Simons work showing many victims to be fake pushed me closer to the truth then I had been since 911.
Ironically I discovered these forums through their attacks on Lets Roll and the forum owner Phil Jayhan at Reality Shack. Which is why I decided to sign up, as I wanted to finally say something about the subject myself and help clear some air. When I first found Reality Shack forums it was wonderful. For the first time since 911 I was starting to get answers. The people and victims were faked. This gave me some of the rest on the subject I wanted. But since that time a few years back, Reality Shack hasn't gone anywhere or seen the implications of their own work,. Did the fake victims work at fake desks, answering fake phones and sitting in fake cubicales? Did the fire department evacuate fake people who never existed, from floors which were never occupied? (How can fake people occupy a real floor?) So there is this great big huge hole in their research, and again they fail to see the implications of their own findings. One thing I do not really get is why they attacked this forum and the owner when he was mirroring their research along different paths. At first they seemed happy and reservedly hopeful, and when you guys kept coming with with one new discovery week after week, they only became more hostile to the work at this forum. A few days ago I got on Reality Shack to catch up on messages and see if anything else is new. I was surprised to see that hostility turned into a ban on your work at Reality Shack. Yes, Simon Shack now forbids the subject of the Hollow Towers even being discussed at his forums. Check out these quotes; http://z6.invisionfree.com/Reality_S...opic=312&st=30 Quote:
Quote:
Let me say that the vicsim research is very good. I think they take it way too far however. At first the matches and work seemed to fit like a glove and answer most questions, but now I go there and only see another picture here and there where they draw arrows all over the pictures and cry out fake! That's the depth of their research at Reality Shack these days. And I look at the new findings there and they aren't even very compelling anymore because they are trying to "force fakery" onto every victim at the World Trade Center regardless of whether they were fake or not, real people or not. Even though I never agreed with everything at his forums, I had a lot of respect for Simon Shack. When I read his response about the Hollow Towers to another member, I lost all respect for this man. He took the low road, and showed himself to be a petty person who loves to be first. And people want the truth, and am sure many others will follow my actions as they themselves get tired of his petty antics and attacks on anyone else who he doesn't first approve. After seeing these attacks after many months I have changed my mind on the reasons why Simon Shack is acting as he is. He hides behind this self righteous "they are here to attack September Clues" schtick regardless of the information or validity of it. They accuse this forum of stealing their research, yet don't see anything here which was stolen from them. Everything here seems to be 99% new and fresh and never heard of before. BTW, kudos on the new discovery of fake smoke machines at the world trade center! So his reasons are hollow and empty, not unlike the towers.  I am appreciative that I do not find the same immature attack mentality here that is so prevalent there. You guys honestly seem more interested in hard hitting new research and discoveries. I wonder what it is that Simon Shack thinks you guys stole from him. The Hollow Towers? He banned this from discussion. The fake shutters system? Fake smoke machines? They had none of these top notch discoveries. Nor are they even excited or care about them, which is awfully suspicious to me. Fake jumpers? That was covered here, not there. At least in the comprehensive way it should be. No contents of the world trade center in the debris pile? They wrongly answer this with mini nukes or space beams and oddly enough won't even consider that the reason nothing is in the debris pile is because it wasn't there to begin with. Whoever it is that first thought of this with all the misinformation out there is a genious! The idea hadn't once, a single time been floated ANYWHERE in 911, not so much as a single time, ever. It is weird but the first time I heard that, within seconds I knew it had to be true. Their reasoning for trashing Phil Jayhan and these forums appears to be centered on Phils work on Flight 175, the pod, missile, blah. This is funny because there was a pod and a missile. I just don't think there was a plane. So how can someone be faulted simply because they didn't see it as CGI right away? And I don't even see any discussion on this here anyway, not for a long time. So to me, their reasons for this trashing appear hollow and empty not unlike the towers. Personally, I think they are experiencing jealousy. These discoveries are larger then anyone here can even remotely understand. I am not sure if you know this here, but these discoveries unlock all of the mysteries of 911 and answer almost every previously unanswerable question. I just wanted to take the time to thank you guys for all of this new research because I can sleep now at night knowing what happened, and am glad to finally be able to know for myself. This research liberated me from confusion and gave me the answers I have sought since 911. And perhaps you guys don't know it because your so close, but these discoveries will be heard around the world eventually, while the vicsim research at Reality Shack stays stuck on the same sandbar they have been stuck on for 3 years. Simon Shack marginalized his own work by displaying such pedantic, childish and selfish attitudes towards all of these new discoveries. I have no ill-will towards Simon, he brought me as far as possible and found it was time to go elsewhere, where discussion is allowed, and the implications of fake victims is researched from a total perspective. It is a crying shame that Simon Shack marginlized himself and his own work by rejecting the obvious implications of his own work. Perhaps they will come around, but don't count on it. I think Reality Shack is going to be stuck on the same sandbar for an awful long time, seeing they rejected the only bridge between themselves and the rest of the truth. (Implications of their own research, Hollow Towers, etc.) I see the members at Reality Shack questioning the legitimacy of a picture showing the hollow towers and seem to question its authenticity. They piss and moan about it, and then speculate. But they won't get off their asses and even do a minimal amount of research or work to verify it or not. This tells me that they long ago got lazy and complacent. A little research here at Lets Roll and they will quickly find this picture was taken by the builder of the WTC and displayed on the website of Leslie E Robertson and Associates. Now when they find out it is authentic, they will find new reasons not to believe what is so plain and clear. That the Towers were Hollow! But that's their problem, not yours.  Well I have rambled on long enough. Thank you for your research and thank you for all of these new discoveries. They have blessed me beyond measure. And be confident that they will be heard around the world. This is all self evident when people come into contact with it, so be certain it will spread. You guys have done an outstanding job and deserve a huge round of applause! Excellent Work! Keep it up! Everyone is watching this forum! Warm Regards, Mark P.S. I sent you a small donation of 15 bucks. Please go out and buy yourself a nice all you can eat steak dinner at the Golden Corral. This is my favorite place to chow, and hopefully you have one near you. I would send more but I am a retired teacher living on small stipends. You guys need to make a movie now. Have you guys thought about this at all? | __________________
911 Was a Hoax Last edited by Phil Jayhan; 29 May 2011 at 23:31 PM. |
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15 Nov 2010
, 18:15 PM
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Re: The Hollow Towers, Reality Shack Forum & Simon Shack
Mark,
Thanks so much for all the encouraging words. Ask Larry, he has heard my many complaints about the general reception from Simon Shack as well as some of his personal attacks he has publicly made, as well as some by his own forum members. But I chose to ignore them and hope that they would come around and embrace the work sooner or later. Apparently your analysis is probably correct. They will never come around, as they are now becoming increasingly more hostile towards the forum with each new discovery made by members here or myself. Which is truly sad and pathetic. Apparently Simon Shack is claiming that his work is the end all be all of 911, and that if anyone surpasses his findings or research then he simply attacks them as being here to "trash September Clues." A ridiculous assertion since I have been tweeting the hell out of his movie now for several months on my twitter account which has about 15,000 followers. http://twitter.com/letsrollforums See for yourselves whether I am telling the truth by going back page after page and seeing how many times I tweeted this movie. Hundreds of times in the last 3-4 months! I think I will probably continue on for a little while but am at my end waiting for these people to come around. I will probably just stop promoting his video altogether, since all he and his forum members do is create personal attacks against me or this forums members. Talk about shooting oneself in the foot! Ouch! And yes, they do indeed take their vicsim research way beyond its legitimate role. It is really not much more then the lookalikes we discovered here on our own without any inspiration from the people at Reality Shack. Lookalikes and vicsims only has a limited shelf life as far as what they can accomplish. Which is why I was all too glad when we found far more significant findings and discoveries, such as the Hollow Towers, Fake lighting and shuttering system and the fake smoke machines. Like you stated so clear, they failed to see the implications of their own research and never once progressed and being stuck on a sandbar is an accurate description of these people and their forums. And since they have nothing new or more significant, they fall complacent and simply turn their brains back off and instead attack anyone who doesn't religously embrace all of their work. It is really sad if you ask me. Perhaps it is jealousy. Or maybe paranoia. But for a forum which hopes their "fakery message" to be accepted, it is odd that they attack anyone who mirrors their findings along different paths as we have done. I wonder what reasoning it is that Simon Shack has actually banned all talk of the Hollow Towers at his forum. I would like an answer to this because it would be fun to listen to as he has no grounds to make such a blanket censoring sweep. But perhaps that's why their forum usually only has 3 people on it at its peak during the day. Now minus you of course. So they have this ultra small following, and they are driving members away by restricting what they are allowed to speak on in TV fakery? This is ironically flavorful. And rather telling. I was thinking about contacting him some months ago but decided to hold off and see how they reacted to this new research. Now I know. Simon Shack banned the Hollow Towers from discussion on his forums. A huge mistake but one that is his to make. The jury is still out on him and his motivations I guess. I am glad now that I didn't prematurely contact him and try to create a bridge. Because it would have been futile and similar to pissing in the wind. And all that that implies... We have the winning hand here in 9/11. We essentially cracked the code and the illusion of 9/11, together here as a forum all on our own without the help of, or inspiration of any other person or group in 9/11. It is all ours, from beginning to end and has our signature written all over it. And it is all completely original research, never before floated or spoken in 911 till Larry and I teamed up and began moving through 911 like a bulldozer with an attitude, on a mission from God. Simon Shack does indeed come across as a highly petty and small man by making such statements, and he also shows he doesn't have much of a thirst for truth, but would rather sit back and attack others work. To be honest I never expected such from him. I expected the opposite. Anyway, thanks for taking the time to write a message and share your thoughts. It was encouraging to see this today, truly encouraging. Cheers- Phil  FYI--- It was Mike Rivero who inspired all of this research and discoveries, most of which would never have been found apart from the inspiration that Mike Rivero gave to me. It was discovering his picture to be John Wenckus which got me started on all of this research, NOT September Clues. So I am thankful to Mike Rivero. He deserves almost as much credit as myself and Larry. If we ever make a movie, we will be crediting Mike Rivero in the credits for his role in bringing this information forward. Mike Rivero was highly instrumental. The Hollow Towers probably would have remained a secret and a mystery if not for Mike Rivero! __________________
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15 Nov 2010
, 22:39 PM
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Re: The Hollow Towers, Reality Shack Forum & Simon Shack
Minuteman aka Mark- outstanding first post. Very enlightening to read your honest assessment of things. Welcome!
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16 Nov 2010
, 02:01 AM
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Re: The Hollow Towers, Reality Shack Forum & Simon Shack
I have a comment. Thank you for your posts on this unfortunate turn of events.
I have to say: Shack has become over-reaching, plus others mis-represent him by thinking that he means all of the video record contained no reality in it at all (which is not what he thinks). But his work stands overall, for many instances, that there was serious manipulation going on. What's clearly happened about the Lera photo, however, is that he applies fakery potential to EVERY image by instinct, now. That's sloppy, but humanly understandable. Background: I have defended Phil's and Larry's work everywhere I can, even to their "enemies".  (Aside: so sad to say that there are so many fanaticisms which take hold of researchers -- Shack's not alone in doing that if he does.) So please take the following comments in that context of my general and deep support for this forum.  But, as you, Minuteman, found with Shack, I was initially warned right on this forum, that "Phil will kick [me] off" if I mention that there were no plane crashes or how some serious manipulation of our video record ("TV fakery") went on.  I wasn't kicked off, fortunate for Phil, me, and everyone. But obviously, such banning of ideas is unfortunate on all sides. The ONLY time to ban ideas is if they've been already worked on, and no new information is presented in a post, or if someone is being gnarly without content. Gnarly may be mere mannerism, however, with ideas as well. Or, say there's something which may have been "investigated", but not thoroughly enough. In either case, a post on containing new positions/info might be necessary, even if initially unwanted by the forum staff. (In my case, I didn't push my knowledge of those things on them, but I should have felt free to post on it -- as long as I gave good back-up for what I had to say.) Hence, I repeat, Shack's work is excellent overall, as is Phil/Larry/this forum. But both have threatened good content to go away.  There is another factor here: overreaching application of ideas/ conclusions which end up distorting some areas of truth when misapplies, even if they're correct for some other items. So we can say: Shack has overreached, in applying "fake" to too many images. But he's right about some. Is there a corollary (so far, and only sometimes) here, at Letsroll? Unfortunately there is. It's normal, but sad.  Let's look at the hollow towers research for example.I am a vocal proponent of that theory (as more than a mere kooky notion). I get heavy flak from it all the time.  But yet I notice that Phil/Larry have sometimes so far overreach with hollow towers just as Shack has done with his work. What I mean is that so far, here, the hollow floors and pre-demo clear-out are supposed to account here for more than they do account for. It's as if we're to think that lack of debris is the only reason to think directed energy weapons were used at some point in the takedown. For the record: lack of debris isn't the whole reason to think that there were DEWs. So we see that both Shack and Larry/Phil have pieces of some puzzles, and overreach at times. It is regrettable about Shack, of course. And we should ask him to account. But almost no-one's immune to these behaviours, on 9/11 sites, I find.  Here's the positive: Now, I will re-iterate why there almost certainly were hollow floors: Unless the Lera photo is faked -- I can lay out again why it is NOT faked, by the way -- it is absolute proof that there were some floors unpoured, (as of when the photo was taken) --- again, if it was not faked. How? It contains internal perspectival evidence which shows mutually exclusively, in a comparison at the same height. The top section on the right, ends in a dark parallelogram (partial side view, plus bottom view), of last poured floor. On the contrary at the same height for the tower on the left, there's no such dark parallelogram (which would be more head-on). If there had been a floor in the segment from that height on up, in the left-hand tower, we would see a corresponding dark, more head-on (frontally foreshortened) parallelogram, of the same thickness (height) in the frame. This is absolute internal comparative, mutual exclusive (tower-to-tower in same view) proof that the sun wouldn't shine at that height. And it does.  Thus, no floors poured in those areas.  There is also the fact we have Tom's testimony, and it makes sense as a scam at the time (mob construction, real estate bubble, etc.). And if no floors were poured later in those areas (and this is unknowable for certain, but highly unlikely to have been poured later), there were un-poured floors. They were all not hollow entirely, though, as you can see. But they were partly.  There was also pre-demo clearout before the destruction --- typical of demos.  I repeat: I have been a firm proponent of there being some hollow floors since I saw the photos and realized how they most likely could not be fake, and why they prove with internal comparative evidence, that if they're not fake there were in fact missing floors (the parallelogram darkness vs light at same height.  On the other hand, as I've said before (hoping not to be "kicked out" -- but I don't think that will happen now), the hollow sections do NOT address the full reasons why directed energy weapons (not merely "explosives" or even mini nukes) probably did the kind of damage to the towers. There is the resultant odd debris state and nanoparticulate cloud, the dustified spire (which anyone careful will see is a spire falling but also leaving more dust in a columnar shape, in its wake, than around it), and the specific condition of the 1,400 "toasted cars" all around. The latter were not all arsoned, for many in turn (i.e., like the WTC) show specific conditions which do not meet fire or nuke only (though nukes may have been used for part of the explosive process).  It is sad that Shack has overreached. I suggest, however, that no-one's work (his or yours or others') be discounted merely for personality or for idea-prejudice.  With best wishes, since I haven't posted here in a while. And thanks for your post, Minuteman, and your honesty, Phil. Best wishes, all, Clare Last edited by Phil Jayhan; 16 Nov 2010 at 04:33 AM. |
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16 Nov 2010
, 12:04 PM
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Re: The Hollow Towers, Reality Shack Forum & Simon Shack
Welcome to LETS ROLL Minuteman.Your first post here was right on spot and also very encouraging.There is still plenty to uncover and the truth shall rise out of the ashes.Stick around,the rides just starting to get really good.
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16 Nov 2010
, 16:36 PM
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Re: The Hollow Towers, Reality Shack Forum & Simon Shack
Thanks for the great analysis Minuteman! It is always good to hear such things from one who has been open minded enough to look at all of the research.
And Welcome to the Forums! Thanks for the defense mclarek, it is and has been much appreciated. We were prepared for the fact that initially this research, like the emperor's new clothes, would be difficult for some to step up to, as this is the very definition of the Big Lie. However, as the discoveries have been piling on, literally each day, it is becoming impossible to deny reasonably. l __________________
"Don't worry about it - Americans don't read." Allan Dulles ... |
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16 Nov 2010
, 20:04 PM
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Re: Parallax - The Hollow Towers, Reality Shack Forum & Simon Shack
I really don't have the patience tonight or the desire to delve into this; And this isn't my cup of tea in 911 anyway. And while I have seen some parts of September Clues, I haven't seen all of it. In the portions I have seen, some of the issues I had with Simons movie deal with this subject.
I think Simons video is good. Just not perfect. And nobody is ever going to make a video on stuff like this without making mistakes. Having said that, I'll let you guys who have the mind for this type of evidence sift through it and give your opinion. I like simpler stuff.  __________________
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16 Nov 2010
, 21:35 PM
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Re: The Hollow Towers, Reality Shack Forum & Simon Shack
Great Video! And I agree........there is plenty of fakery to go around without faking more!
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18 Nov 2010
, 12:26 PM
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Re: The Hollow Towers, Reality Shack Forum & Simon Shack
Hey Phil,
I first came across your work on the two part Fetzer radio show a while ago. I've followed what I had always considered the 'leaders' of the truth movement for 8+ yrs, groups I now have major concerns with in the way they've cornered their own efforts so to speak. That cornering or keeping to the 'outer layer' of evidence was only clear to me after I heard you and Larry on that show; that under the deception, there is even more deception. I had signed up on Sept. clues forum a while back - thought the video fakery was amazing and it was where I'd first ever heard of the idea of a fake victim until I heard it from you guys. Anyway I was surprised to find this thread here and the attitude you've gotten from those guys. Since there appears to be some obvious bridges to be made from their work and the amazing stuff here, I put up an intro. on their 'intro' thread to talk about one bridge I see using the specific example of the '11 scenarios for victims' Larry went through on the show. After literally finishing my post praising them 'heros' and 'patriots'...I still hurt somebody's feelings enough to get suspended for two years. I have that intro. and replies and rather than take up space here, if you are curious give me an address, I can send them in a Word doc or just as text. I didn't even get a chance to respond to their take on my comments and I would have liked to since they seemed to misconstrue a couple points while never responding to the comments I made on your work. Apparently I have nothing to 'contribute' there although I considered my effort a 'contribution' had they taken it as it was intended. I don't know whether to laugh or kick my cat...ha, totally kidding. Well let me know and keep up ALL the great work here. Kevin |
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18 Nov 2010
, 14:50 PM
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Re: The Hollow Towers, Reality Shack Forum & Simon Shack
TBT-
Dont feel like the Lone Ranger......same thing happened to me over there. They are VERY jealous of their work and theories.....if you challenge them on any point you are placed on a "watch list" and will be banned if you have the audacity to question something the second time. You simply cannot have any discussion "outside the box" with those guys! This forum is more like "family", and even small contributions are welcomed! I commend Simon for his work but I think that group is self destructing.... several of their better researchers have left over the last couple months. They aren't open to anything new, and IMHO, their water is stagnating. |
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